Religious Right Stands Up For Discrimination
The religious right is up in arms about new legislation entitled the Employment Non-Discrimination Act (ENDA). According to the Associated Press:
The Employment Non-Discrimination Act would make it illegal for employers to make decisions about hiring, firing, promoting or paying an employee based on sexual orientation or gender identity. Churches and the military would be exempt.
Not surprisingly, religious right organizations have come out strongly opposing this legislation. Focus on the Family out a call to action to their members, stating:
ENDA would prohibit employers from making employment decisions — such as hiring, promotions and firing — based on an individual’s “actual or perceived sexual orientation or gender identity.” Organizations deemed “religious enough” would be exempt.
Congress needs to hear that American businesses oppose ENDA, which is bad for the bottom line, bad for employees and bad for business. Some nonprofit businesses fear it could even lead to the loss of their tax-exempt status.
So, workplace discrimination is ok with the religious right. Good to know.
These are the same tired arguments we have heard before to justify racial and gender discrimination.
As for the government decising if an organization is “religious enough,” failing to make this distinction would allow any commercial entity to set itself up as a church.
I had a friend who was an ordained priest (or “Boo-Hoo”) in the Paleo-American Church, which was claiming to be a religious organization in the hope of having their sacrament - LSD - being allowed for religious purposes. (They also believed that all good came from Saturn, and were devoted to stoping a planned invasion of Saturn by a rival church, but that’s neither here nor there.)
I doubt anyone at FoF would object to the government’s decision that these folks were not, in fact, a church. Why, then, is it wrong for government to make that same determination in order to prevent workplace discrimination?
Discrimination is abominable…for any reason.
When it happens to them, the religious right makes it overly dramatic by calling it persecution. Did anyone notice their overarching need to always place themselves in a separate “class” from others?
Their ignorance and intolerance is their downfall. Their UNchristlike hypocrisy will be their demise.
How ironic that these religious organizations want the right to not hire someone if that person is even perceived to be gay, and yet, one after another, religious leaders are being exposed as perverts, pedophiles, adulterers, liars, cheats, frauds and just plain scumbags.
And don’t get your knickers in a knot. I didn’t say ALL religious leaders.
Fox News will probably treat this like they treat most issues. For an example of what I’m talking about, check this vid from Brave New Films re: how Fox treated the Betrayus debacle.
http://foxattacks.com/blog/13034-fox-s-balanced-analysis-of-the-petraeus-hearings?utm_source=rgemail
“Did anyone notice their overarching need to always place themselves in a separate “class” from others?”
Well said Alba. They are megalomaniacs. They really think they know more and know better because of their beliefs in a magic sky god fantasy. Very scary.
The article states, “It is time for the church of Jesus Christ to rise up and speak the truth in love. Individual rights of homosexuals do not supersede the individual rights of Christians, and especially not those who own a business and provide jobs to our nation.”
This is quite a strong attack on gays, hate speech in my book.
The logical consequense of this would be that eventually, as soon as they were found out, no gay people would be able to work. Then, I guess they would just euthanize them. Christian-like, that.
But dale, they said it was spoken “in love.” And don’t forget about all those jobs Xtian companies are creating. Having gay workers would be SO demoralizing for the Xtians working along side such evil sinners that it would certainly impact American productivity negatively.
It’s important to make sure that gays don’t find employment in private sector jobs where they might have to work next to alleged “Christians.” After all, if gays arent stopped here, next they’ll try to find work in fashion or the arts.
LOL, good ones!
I gotem me an idear.
Let jus amen the Consituion so thatn evry merican must bee
a borne agin Christin and only do luvn to opisit sex peoples;anythin elsen bee
ilegale pervursion!
so saith i, a god-feerin Merican!
Gol dang it. Dat ders zactly wad I was a gonna say. Shoot.
I bleeve there be a few Sensatators and Congresscritters who may be fixin’ to do jes that very thang, y’all.
(Alex queuing banjo music)
Squeeeeeeeeeeel like a pig.
“you sure got purty mouth, boy”
This explans a whoooooooole lot,
Noyatin Says:
I had a friend who was an ordained priest (or “Boo-Hoo”) in the Paleo-American Church, which was claiming
to be a religious organization in the hope of having their sacrament - LSD - being allowed for religious
purposes.
(They also believed that all good came from Saturn, and were devoted to stoping a planned invasion of
Saturn by a rival church, but that’s neither here nor there.)
yap, a whooole lot.
Albatross Says:
Their ignorance and intolerance is their downfall. Their UNchristlike hypocrisy will be their demise.
What does Christlikeness mean to you, personally???
C.T. Says:
How ironic that these religious organizations want the right to not hire someone if that person is even perceived to be gay, and yet, one after another, religious leaders are being exposed as perverts, pedophiles, adulterers, liars, cheats, frauds and just plain scumbags.
Maybe that’s why they don’t want to hire more.
September 18th, 2007 at 11:19 am
Alex Says:
Well said Alba. They are megalomaniacs. They really think they know more and know better because of their
beliefs in a magic sky god fantasy. Very scary.
just a question to clear things up, Alex,
Who are these megalomaniacs???
WHO go you claim have “beliefs in a magic sky god fantasy”???
dell Says:
The article states, “It is time for the church of Jesus Christ to rise up and speak the truth in love. Individual rights of homosexuals do not supersede the individual rights of Christians, and especially not those who own a business and provide jobs to our nation.”
This is quite a strong attack on gays, hate speech in my book.
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
someone needs to re-read his own myth text, particularly those parts about a diety coming down from heaven, burning bushes, tablets carved by the finger of a diety, angels, messengers of a diety descending in fire chariots with “wheels within wheels’, etc .
those are some of the characteristics of the ’sky kings ‘
that deluded adherents of Abramic religions
claim to owe obeisance.
Abrahamic
Ezekial Chpt I Ezekial Chpt 10
Has anyone ween this story about John McCain being confused about his religion? Funny stuff.
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/09/17/mccain_overall_faith_whats_important/
..but..he knows he’s a christian..however he might later choose to interpret that!
This is from the AP wire tonight.
Military Sued Over Religious Freedom
By JOHN MILBURN
FORT RILEY, Kan. (AP) — A soldier whose superior prevented him from holding a meeting for atheists and other non-Christians is suing the Defense Department, claiming it violated his right to religious freedom.
The lawsuit, filed in U.S. District Court in Kansas City, Kan., alleges a pattern of practices that discriminate against non-Christians in the military. It was filed Monday to coincide with the 220th anniversary of the signing of the U.S. Constitution.
The lawsuit names Defense Secretary Robert Gates and Maj. Paul Welborne as defendants.
According to the filing, Spec. Jeremy Hall, a soldier assigned to Fort Riley’s 97th Military Police Battalion, received permission to distribute fliers around his base in Iraq for a meeting of atheists and non-Christians.
When he tried to convene the meeting, Hall claims, Welborne stepped in, threatening to file military charges against Hall and block his reenlistment.
read the rest here:
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/MILITARY_RELIGION_LAWSUIT?SITE=FLTAM&SECTION=US
“…Onward CHRISTIAN soldiers..marching off to war..” Jews, Hndus, Muslims,Buddhists, Pagans need not apply!
Yahead, “DefCon is a group that allows for individual opinions and thoughts, but when your opinions and thoughts go against the grain to the extent that you often go, alienation sets in and the discord and discontent that follows serves no good purpose.”
“Who are these megalomaniacs???”
YOU - you f-ing retard.
You really need to work on your comprehension skills you dim-wit.
Go chant to your deity or something….your mental skills really suck and you don’t add value here.
You are an ignorant, obnoxious, self-bloated human. You know nothing about anything worth while but act like you have the key to everything. You and your ilk are the BANE of humanity. You bath in your sheltered stupidity and think it makes you clean and above reproach. But in reality, its stench only masks the smells of the festering boils of fear-led ignorance that poison your mind and command you to infect others with blind allegiance to the menagerie of fabricated wishes - wishes that bring idiots like you emotional comfort and false purpose. Weakling.
I believe the words are, marching AS to war.
Alex,
While I understand your frustration, please don’t lump everyone who has a spiritual faith in the same category as those who seek to force their beliefs upon everyone else. As you well know, I have a deep faith in a supreme being; that faith brings me comfort and helps me find meaning in my life. Does that mean I am a “weakling”? I don’t think that it does.
“and command you to infect others with blind allegiance to the menagerie of fabricated wishes”
Lynne,
I personally have zero respect for any idea that has no parallel, no referential integrity, or exemplar. However, I have utter disdain for those who would expect me to accept those kinds of ideas as “real” just because they do.
Personally Lynne, I feel that Nature is all encompassing and controls and even steers all events. I subscribe to this notion because there is overwhelming evidence to support it. Those who so arrogantly disagree, I feel, should be able to show and explain their complete and magnanimous understanding of EVERYTHING about Nature and SHOW how it is NOT capable of the wonders we observe. Magic and mysticism in my view, has had its chance for millennia now – and it has failed MISERABLY. I’m not one to give it anymore credence than a belief in the tooth-fairy….literally. It’s all VERY silly to me. HOWEVER, I understand that I am one interacting with many others of different persuasions. So I temper my disdains and boil them down to this: If one is able to engage in rational discourse, respect is deserved. If one cannot, then disrespect is delivered if I am approached. Rationality, the child of logical thinking, is the foundation of productive, meaningful discourse. Even music and art contain those traits - they just make them interesting. If someone wants to argue and foist that down is up, and seeing something means your blind, then my natural instinct is to thump them.
Alex Says:
You bath in your sheltered stupidity and think it makes you clean and above reproach.
No alex I am not above reproach nor do i think I’m about reproach.
Is that what this is about, am i bruising your ego.
I personally have zero respect for Alex.
ALLex has utter disdain for those who disagree with him.
Alex,
you are the most conceited twit on this blog.
your loathful self worship is pathetic.
go ask your mommy to teach you about humility
“No alex I am not above reproach nor do i think I’m about reproach.”
That is certainly not how your presence here is perceived by those who can read.
“….am i bruising your ego.”(?)
I doubt you possess enough of anything to bruise me anywhere. However if you would like a shot at my ego, let’s talk intelligently about physics, or geology, or astronomy. But first, just to make sure we’re on a level playing field, you should be sure to have studied each subject at the college level for at least 1 year.
“I personally have zero respect for Alex.”
Clearly. But you could have substituted “any rational thinker” for my name and your proclamation would still be true. Bottom line - who cares - you’re an ignorant idiot. It’s like a maggot-infested frog-corpse telling me it has zero respect for me. You’re a douche.
“ALLex has utter disdain for those who disagree with him.”
I have full respect for those who INTELLIGENTLY disagree with me. Those who disagree just because they think they are right or just because of some “ordained” agenda they think they have should refer to the previous point.
You have shown clearly and unequivocally that you are an obnoxious, ignorant, moron.
“your loathful self worship is pathetic.”
What the f-ck is “…loathful self worship….”. What is that supposed to mean? Do you just pull out sophisticated sounding words from your ass and use them to be impressive?
MJ - you are a PROVEN LIAR. Go fondle yourself and ask your pretend-man-deity for forgiveness after you squirt your load into your hand. Take your humility and wipe your ass with it - along with your supreme ignorance, bullying arrogance, and bullshit beliefs.
September 18th, 2007 at 10:50 pm
Bill_from_defcon Says:
Yahead, “DefCon is a group that allows for individual opinions and thoughts, but when your opinions and thoughts go against the grain to the extent that you often go, alienation sets in and the discord and discontent that follows serves no good purpose.”
Now Bill — you should know better than to use my words without giving proper credit.
ALL ex, you claim that you, “have utter disdain for those who would expect me to accept those kinds of ideas as “real” just because they do.”
Alex you also stated, I feel that Nature is all encompassing and controls and even steers all events. I subscribe to this notion because there is overwhelming evidence to support it. Those who so arrogantly disagree, I feel, should be able to show and explain their complete and magnanimous understanding of EVERYTHING about Nature and SHOW how it is NOT capable of the wonders we observe.
First, you want anyone who simply disagrees with your religion of naturalism to “explain their complete and magnanimous understanding of EVERYTHING”
BTW did you know that magnanimous means being very generous?
Second your statement, “I’m not one to give it anymore credence than a belief in the tooth-fairy….literally. It’s all VERY silly to me.”
So you place your credence of belief in Mother Nature??? Good choice, dude.
You said, So I temper my disdains and boil them down to this: If one is able to engage in rational discourse, respect is deserved. If one cannot, then disrespect is delivered if I am approached.
Alex, do you remember your Vile, indecent, offensive, nauseating, repugnant rant a few weeks ago????????
Now Bill — you should know better than to use my words without giving proper credit.
I was waiting to see who would attack me. dale can’t even agree with me about the tazing.
hey I did use “-”’s
“First, you want anyone who simply disagrees with your religion of naturalism to “explain their complete and magnanimous understanding of EVERYTHING”
Following evidence is not a religion. Proof is real and does not require a church or mystical belief. It just kills you if you’re wrong. Easy.
“BTW did you know that magnanimous means being very generous?”
Again, those comprehension skills would help you out when you need to understand words in context…ass. English must not be your first language….I would only hope.
“So you place your credence of belief in Mother Nature??? Good choice, dude.”
Yeah, I agree, proof and evidence is a great choice. Why did you choose your deity - why not Zeus or Allah? Ass.
“Alex, do you remember your Vile, indecent, offensive, nauseating, repugnant rant a few weeks ago????????”
F-uck your sensitivities. Please refresh my memory so I can do it again you waste of skin.
“So you place your credence of belief in Mother Nature??? Good choice, dude.”
Science and the craft of listening to “Mother Nature” has probably SAVED YOUR LIFE more than once you ignorant turd.
Prayer only gives you goose-bumps.
Alex,
Uh, your just a conceited little shit.
Why don’t you go ask your mommy to say some nice things to you.
I’ve got a hot girlfriend for that you weak-minded, deceit-worshipper. Twice in a row you’ve referred to my “mommy”. Dude, my mommy days are long gone. You’re efforts to maximize the impact of your posts by utilizing non-sequiters and pseudo-degrading remarks only tell of your subversive methods. You are a weakling. I would invite you to come out in the open and spar intellectually but you can’t - you don’t have the knowledge or the desire for truth. Weakling. Go learn something real, things you can see and measure. Ignorant fool.
Millions of years have honed life to be brutish. Life is raw. To get that meaning, go watch the Serengeti. Intelligence brings learning. Learning brings civility. Civility brings mercy, kindness, and love. These are known as “emergent properties”, the same as color and heat. However, color and heat do not procreate, do not care. Humans, because of their intelligence, can. These ideas mean nothing to those who think (i.e. know) that humans are decrepit and flaws (yes flaws, not flawed). To those that see humans as the result of many years and many efforts of Natural processes, is (almost) the most profound and meaningful emergent property achieved by Natural processes.
We have a way. We have a purpose. Believing in wishes, lies, or myth, serve neither.
“is (almost) the most profound and meaningful”
should read:
“it is (almost) the most profound and meaningful”
bill asked Albatross “What does Christlikeness mean to you, personally???”.
I don’t know what Albatross thinks, but to me, Christlikeness is a guy who is sexy as all getout, dressed in his loincloth, all sweaty and manly muscled.
Toting that cross must give a guy GREAT abs!
The rabid religious fundie “christian” freaks like Dobson and Perkins are afraid if ENDA passes, their own organizations won’t be allowed to discriminate against gay people without losing their tax exempt status.
And so many of those fundie mouth fu*kers are closet queens themselves.
Don : I think you are probably right.
je-zeus hung around with 12 GUYS( ok he literally HUNG with two), but he caroused with 12 BOYS, running aound in nothing but loin cloth and robes…always together…night and day…day and ight… eating , talking , sleeping TOGETHER for YEARS.
Sure sounds like a gay clutch to me!
Bill,
You are an obnoxious bore and a liar.
You operate with a diminished mental capacity. State your opiions all you want. It just continues to prove what I said.
All,
I am a bit curious about something.
OK. Craig makes eye contact with the cop. He goes into the stall. He plays footsies, then makes the hand signal. If the cop hadn’t terminated the activity, and actually had been someone looking for “something,” what would have happened next?
I would imagine that Craig would have come into the stall with the cop. At THAT point, there would be NO doubt his intention. Maybe the cop jumped the gun because the whole incident was so creepy.
I think it would have been Craig that “jumped the gun” - so to speak.
However, as someone pointed out somewhere I was reading, if the police wanted to STOP the “illegal” activity in the restrooms, they could have posted signs and had uniformed cops patrol. Obviously they are more interested in arresting people than stopping the activity. Of course, there is the possibility that the police “believe” that by arresting people, the word will get out that anonymous sex in this particular restroom should be avoided. Ironically, I read an officer stating in effect that putting up signs and patrolling would make it harder to catch people having “illegal” sex. So, draw your own conclusions. I’m not an expert on law enforcement, but lately, it seems like cops arrest now and ask questions later.
That being said, I have no problem with Craig getting busted. He’s a hypocrite and a liar.
Alex, I thought about that when I wrote it and almost added (no pun intended)
OK OK, I get the picture.
Perhaps they figured that if they put up signs, the perpetrators would merely move to another rest room. They needed to make a “statement.” As CT stated, I can’t speak to that with any authority either.
Bill_from_defcon Says:
dell Says:
The article states, “It is time for the church of Jesus Christ to rise up and speak the truth in love. Individual rights of homosexuals do not supersede the individual rights of Christians, and especially not those who own a business and provide jobs to our nation.”
This is quite a strong attack on gays, hate speech in my book.
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
bill,
You and your ilk exude hate.
You are a fukking asshole.
You do not deserve an explanation to anything, you retard.
The fundies preach hate.
bill,
What the fukk are you trying to prove? How idiotic you can be?
More and more businesses support granting things like domestic partnership benefits to gay employees, and more and more support ENDA. When the fundie “christian” assholes like Perkins claim passing ENDA would be bad for businesses, he is lying and as usual, full of shit.
The wierdest thing is the fact that the fundies want to exclude anyone that even APPEARS gay? As if….
Can you say Rock Hudson?
What a bunch of sociopaths.
Wouldn’t that be “thought” policing
? Once again, they shine in the field of hypocrisy.
dell Says:
The article states, “It is time for the church of Jesus Christ to rise up and speak the truth in love. Individual rights of homosexuals do not supersede the individual rights of Christians, and especially not those who own a business and provide jobs to our nation.”
This is quite a strong attack on gays, hate speech in my book.
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
cockroach, please explain what part of the above is HATE SPEECH??????
They want the gays to starve to death. That is hate.
That’s too simple an explanation, dale. Perhaps something a little more convoluted would register.
bill?
I think he’s digging through his dictionary so he can post the definition of hate or something.
Here’s an article from the Human Rights Campaign about a recent poll showing most people support ENDA.
http://www.hrcbackstory.org/2007/09/a-new-study-out.html
Thanks, Don.
This is good; there is hope for all:
“Even though many voices on the far right are determined to spread lies and incite disgusting prejudice against GLBT workers as we work to pass ENDA, these types of statistics show that the country’s opinion on our right to equal employment rights, as a whole, is heading in the right direction.”
Repost from RR option 08 thread:
This is best for today’s open, but I will be leaving soon (for the day) and probably won’t make it to the open thread.
We often talk about how quickly certain folks would change their tune, if they were to learn that a close family member was gay. Here is the video clip of San Francisco Mayor, Jerry Sanders, who up until now said he would veto a marriage equality resolution. He always felt that the civil union alternative was separate, but equal. Deep soul-searching has helped him to realize that it is not the same at all.
Watch as he has to grapple with reality.
http://cbs5.com/video/?id=26888@kpix.dayport.com
Cockroach, you are playing mind games and it looks as if the simple-minded mice are following you as they always do. This has NOTHING to do with people starving to death. Like all good libbyies you try so hard to cloud the issues so the truth is hide away.
In order for gays to starve would be if gays only make up and tiny portion of our population and if the thinking of mainstream American finds homosexuals to be that sickening, then maybe you would be right and American would allow people to stave.
Is that what you’re saying dale, that American knows that homosexuals don’t deserve to live? YOU ARE SO SICK.
COCKROACH, WHO ARE YOU TO SPREAD YOUR HATE AGAINST HOMOSEXUALS.
bill, denying people jobs because of their homosexual orientation is denying them a livelihood. Understand?
Don I understand, I also understand dale’s calling this a hate crime is an insult to real gay victims of real gay hate crimes.
That was my point.
But bill…the folks who are trying to keep gay people from holding jobs are contributing to the atmosphere that causes the more serious hate crimes like assault and murder.
false
No, Bill, it is not false…it is quite true. If you actually took a look at the real world, you would see that this is merely the tip of the iceberg.
who complained about this troll?
DOUBLE STANDARDS
You will complain about ANYTHING a Christian does.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:21 pm
yahweh Says:
The Iranian president
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why didn’t dale the cockroach complain???
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:37 pm
dale Says:
Uh, oh. Yahweh is pissed. What’s got you wound up?
Why didn’t ct complain???????????????????
bill thinks the Iranian president is a christian.
There you have it, people…another in the “Inane Quote Mining of Bill” series, which merely shows that Bill, having nothing of any import to say, diligently searches other people’s posts that he can cut and paste in order to show everyone that he can’t do anything constructive with his time.
Bill - if you’re going to say Don’s assessment is false…..the BACK IT UP WITH SOME FACTS.
September 24th, 2007 at 6:26 am
Don Rettmann Says:
bill thinks the Iranian president is a christian.
FALSE
Bill — that’s (see your 3:51pm post) not the assessment to which I was referring as to needing facts to back up your claim of falsehood. Rather, below is the one that you claimed is false and I say, BACK IT UP WITH FACTS:
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:20 am
Don Rettmann Says:
But bill…the folks who are trying to keep gay people from holding jobs are contributing to the atmosphere that causes the more serious hate crimes like assault and murder.
September 23rd, 2007 at 12:02 pm
Bill_from_defcon Says:
false
Thanks C.T.
bill…?
Your ball.
Oy vey.
C.T. Says:
Bill — that’s (see your 3:51pm post) not the assessment to which I was referring as to needing facts to back up your claim of falsehood. Rather, below is the one that you claimed is false and I say, BACK IT UP WITH FACTS:
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:20 am
Don Rettmann Says:
But bill…the folks who are trying to keep gay people from holding jobs are contributing to the atmosphere that causes the more serious hate crimes like assault and murder.
September 23rd, 2007 at 12:02 pm
Bill_from_defcon Says:
false
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Nice try CT. nice try.
Your problem is this, Don make the claim, it is his job to support the claim.
funny that.
Okay, Bill…let’s try this…if you deny someone the right to work you contribute to their lack of income. Lacking an income means that one can not pay for the essentials of life, such as food and shelter. The lack of those essentials of life can lead to violent crime by the one lacking these essentials, prompting retaliation, which often consists of attacks upon innocent individuals who have not committed any crime other than to be different from the norm.
Lynne, why should a small business be forced to hire a white guy man, over a black non-gay man?
why in this world you believe gays are so violent as to commit violent crimes?
bill…if I owned a business, and I refused to hire a black man, and you were qualified for the job, how would you feel?
bill…suppose you and I live in a small community, and I own the only business around, and I refuse to hire you because you are black….wouldn’t I be depriving you of your livelihood?
Suppose, because I deprived you of a livelihood, you had to resort to stealing to support yourself and your family. Then the other people in the community might begin to distrust all black people, because you, a black man, had stolen stuff from people.
And suppose these community members started hating all black people, and started beating up black people, because they think, mistakenly, that all black people are crooks and thieves.
Wouldn’t that be unfair to you and all black people?
That’s the kind of situation that can happen.
Also, by denying people jobs because of some trait they have, race, orientation, nationality, sex, whatever…the job denyer is contributing to the dehumanization of those people.
Do we need a law that says, dale has to hire Christians who pray. NO
But we need to enforce the one that makes it illegal to fire ANYONE because they pray.
Do we need a law that says, a business has to hire high school dropouts?
Do we need a law that says, a business has to hire liberal, republicans?
Do we need a law that says, a business has to hire people you joined the boy scouts or girl scouts?
Do we need a law that says, a business has to hire people who are left handed? why not they were born left handed?
Personally, I think we need a law that states that an employer must hire the best qualified applicant for a given job, and that an employer can’t fire an employee for any reason that is not job related, unless the reason is for committing a criminal act for which the employee is convicted.
I think the government needs to keep its noise out of my business.
We need to enforce anti-discrimination laws, and those laws should be expanded so as to reflect inclusion of all human beings.
Jobs should be filled based on qualifications, nothing more, nothing less.
Some believe public policy works best when the religious keep their noise(?) out of others’ private business instead of bribing politicians. Votes for biblical law.
Interesting point about being left handed…it not that long ago was considered a bad thing. Some even thought it was evil.
Just a few generations ago, some kids who were left handed would have their left arms tied behind their backs, forcing them to use their right hand.
Kinda dumb, wasn’t it?
Left and right handedness is a lot like hetero and homo sexual orientation. Both are natural. One is less common than the other. Neither is by itself better or worse than the other, nor more or less moral.
I think a business owner should not refuse to hire someone because he/she is left handed or right anded.
Nor should the business owner refuse to hire someone because he/she is gay…or straight.
bill said,
Did you know that science can NOT prove that water will boil and become steam at 211 degrees with certainty. Why? Because, there is not one single bit of prove of any kind, anywhere, for water boiling and become steam at 211 degrees.”- ***STOP THIS IS ONLY PART OF THE POST.***
cockroach says.
Absurd. Stunningly absurd. This is abject and total ignorance. at Standard Pressure, water boils at 212 degrees, not 211 degrees F.
First of all, It is very easy to prove that water boils (creating steam) at 212 degrees Farenheit,
But only at Standard Pressure.
This is an easy empirical proof because it can be observed. What bill probably doesn’t know is
The boiling point of water is 212 degrees F at standard pressure.
On top of Mount Everest at 29,029 feet above sea level the atmospheric pressure is less so the boiling point of water is 156.2 degrees F, and I can prove it.
Oh by the way, water boils at 211 degrees F at an elevation of 500 ft above sea level. bill is an idiot. He has no understanding of physics whatsoever. I can just see the gyrations bill will go through to lie his way out of this one. He’ll probably try to say he was joking or something equally disengenuous(sic). He just keeps getting deeper and deeper.
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cockroach, you are stealing my thunder.
Yes, water will boil at 211.
In fact water will boil at 210 in Denver, CO.
Question, if the pressure is about standard does the boiling point go up.
Here are the facts, Conclusive test of a scientific model occurs when something is shown to be false.
Proving that something is true requires complete, meaning absolutely (ALL) the information know and unknown, which something that we can never have.
Science works with incomplete information by design. Understanding these boundaries of the scientific method can expose bad science.
Here is why.
A model is developed and predictions are made.
If evidence or experiment disagrees with the predictions * the model doesn’t work and needs to be modified.
If evidence or experiment agrees with the predictions * the model is supported by the results
*** but, because of the possibility of a better model, and the possibility that new data can change things, the model has not be proven.
Example, someone boils water and it turns to steam at 212 degrees f.
The model states water will boils at 212. The predictions is made that water will boil at 212.
PEOPLE ALL OVER THE WORLD boil water and it turns to steam at 212.
Have we PROVEN that water boils at 212?
No, at best we can ONLY say that our model agrees with current observations and measurements.
Why, because… Next someone in Denver, CO test the theory and discoverers that in Denver water boils at 210.
The model will now be tested and updated to find out why this happens.
Have we proved anything now??? NO, Why not??? Because we still don’t and never will have ALL the complete information, both know and unknown, which is something that we can never have.
So, any Scientist or any other person who claims a model is true is only stating an opinion.
The very best anyone can say is that the model agrees with current observations and measurements.
Claims of scientific consensus as proof is still, only an opinion.
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September 27th, 2007 at 2:04 pm
Bill_from_defcon Says:
Upon further review, The following is my post.
Why does DALE, FEEL THIS NEED TO MISQUOTE ME?
September 26th, 2007 at 10:26 pm
Bill_from_defcon Says:
Lynne, the problem is NOT a lack of evidence. The problem is judging the evidence with an open mind.
Christians and atheists share the same evidence however we view it from a different prospective.
Science can NOT prove anything with certainty. Science can NOT prove the existence of God with certainty. Science can NOT DISprove the existence of God with certainty. Science can NOT prove our model of the solar system with certainty. If science can NOT prove our model of the solar system with certainty,
Did you know that science can NOT prove that water will boil and become steam at 211 degrees with certainty.
Why, Because, there is not one single bit of evidence of any kind, anywhere, for water boiling and become steam at 211 degrees. NO. that is not the reason. So what is the reason.
Nice try, roach, it looks as if I forgot to add the question marks. However, I’m sure a person of your insight knew that these where questions OR WHY ELSE WOULD LEAVE OFF THE LAST TWO SENTENSES?
Yes I should have used question marks, making the passage read,
Why, Because, there is not one single bit of evidence of any kind, anywhere, for water boiling and become steam at 211 degrees(?) NO. that is not the reason(?) So what is the reason(?)
DALE, WHY DID YOU FEEL A NEED TO MISQUOTE ME?
Dale, was your misquoting me an accident or are you just dishonest?????
Nice try, roach,
WHY WOULD YOU LEAVE OFF THE LAST TWO SENTENSES?
Dale, was your misquoting me a mistake or are you dishonest???
knock knock, any one home.
dale, why did you post this on so many threads?
Don, did you know that the word for “left” comes from a Middle English word meaning “weak”?
Lynne, left means weak are you sure that’s RIGHT?
dawg, she is right about left.
ETYMOLOGY:
Middle English, from Old English lyft-, weak, useless (in lyftdl, paralysis)
http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/left
yes, your RIGHT this does not mean the left is week.
Lynne…no, I didn’t know that.
Thanks.
It kind of makes sense, if you think about it, since most people are right-handed, which makes the left hand the weaker hand.
Lynne, here’s a link to famous (and infamous) lefties. Some interesting surprises.
http://www.indiana.edu/~primate/left.html#U.S.%20Presidents
I would be completely unable to do many things, writing for one, with my left hand.
Be glad you have a choice, Don.
Let us not forget the not-so-famous.
Do you know the number of people today, who have poor handwriting because they were lefties forced to be
righties? It isn’t even funny.
I am fortunate, C.T. Very much so.
Albatross, my best friend’s mother was one of those people who, as a kid, had teachers pressuring her to use her right hand. Idiots.
The team “Reactance” better explains why atheist hate a God they claim not to believe in. Reactance is “a person’s tendency to resist social influences that they perceive as threats to their autonomy.” (lifetwo.com) The fact that atheist are often raised in religious families, they have a tendency to resist the authority of the parents whom “they perceive as threats to their” independence and personal self-sufficiency.
This rebellion against parental power if not dealt with, may cause adult sufferers to parade or flaunt abhorrence toward a deity they maintain no faith in.
Autonomy meaning of course the child’s perceived capacity to make its own moral decisions. The atheist comes to believe religious training has limited their freedom to act out personal moral decisions.
Features of Reactance Theory,
Step 1. People perceive an unfair restriction on their actions.
*** God isn’t fair, Why can’t I do this?
Step 2. A state of reactance is activated.
*** God’s not going to tell me what to do,
Step 3. The person must act to remove the reactance.
–“The reactance cannot be ignored or put aside.”-
***So I just won’t believe in God anymore. He he he.
The motivational qualities of reactance are so strong that the person must do something about it. The reactance cannot be ignored or put aside. In particular the person is motivated to either “right the wrong” or to get around the restriction. In other words, people with reactance will try to get the unfair restriction removed or they will try to subvert the restriction.
(wvu.edu)
REFERENCES AND RECOMMENDED READINGS
Brehm, J. (1966). A theory of psychological reactance. New York: Academic Press.
Brehm, J., & Weintraub, M. (1977). Physical barriers and psychological reactance:
2-year-olds response to threats to freedom. Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 35
830-836.
.
Closeup of the troll.
the above post of course point to the posters “Reactance”.
they want to ignore me but can’t because they perceive my post as a threat to their independence and personal self-sufficiency.
The poster has lose all control they must act to remove the reactance.
The motivational qualities of reactance are so strong that the person must do something about it. The reactance cannot be ignored or put aside. In particular the person is motivated to either “right the wrong” or to get around the restriction. In other words, people with reactance will try to get the unfair restriction removed or they will try to subvert the restriction.
(wvu.edu)
I’ve said this before, please get some professional help.
pity that.
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