Dobson Takes Electoral Organizing To the Churches — This Time Publicly
Dobson is launching a voter drive, based out of churches and focused explicitly on empowering the religious right’s political agenda.
From the LA Times:
As discontent with the Republican Party threatens to dampen the turnout of conservative voters in November, evangelical leaders are launching a massive registration drive that could help counter the malaise and mobilize new religious voters in battleground states.
The program, coordinated by the Colorado-based group Focus on the Family and its influential founder, James C. Dobson, would use a variety of methods — including information inserted in church publications and booths placed outside worship services — to recruit millions of new voters in 2006 and beyond.
The effort builds on the aggressive courtship of evangelical voters in 2004 by President Bush’s reelection campaign, even as the Internal Revenue Service has announced renewed scrutiny of nonprofit organizations, including churches, that engage in political activities.
Any church who allows itself to partner with this idea of Dr. Dobson’s is flirting with losing its nonprofit status. I will not hesitate to report any infraction to the IRS. As a Christian, I follow the teachings of Jesus, not Dr. Dobson.
Good girl!! I came from a background in which Dobson is seen as incapable of wrong. He is arrogant and greedy, two things that, as a Christian, he certainly should not be.
I agree 100% that he needs to have his nonprofit status revoked, unequivocally. I’m not a religeous person at all, but let me tell you something, if people of the christian faith can’t see what Mr. Dobson is up to, and let me assure you, he isn’t doing the lords work. As far as I can tell, he’s either the Devil himself or one of his right hand men. How in the world anyone would listen to a narrow minded bigot like that is beyond me.
Dobson is a hate monger.
He was reared in a family of intolerance.
He will not even grant an interview to the media.
He is a meglomaniac.
His position is opposed by all of the psycocological community.
There is no….. repeat…no…clinical evidence to support his theories….. He is homophobic to the highest degree.
He is grooming his son to take over his dynasty.
He is a millionaire. He likes it. He is all about controling and aquiring money.
Yes, he is smart, and convincing, but he is a divider of our societal norms. If there is an anti christ.. he is it.
There is nobody on the face of the earth that should buy in to his philosophy of raising kids unless they were brought up being abused by their parents. He is the perfect example.
Dobson was kickd in the shins by his father and he tries to prtray it as a spiritual experience. In all his education he does not recognize it as the abuse as it is.
This as a pathetic, albeit, ” successful person to those who do not think about the repercussions of this kind of upbringing. It only spawns bigotry and hatred, no matter how he trys to couch it.
Dobson is a pathetic piece of shit and I can show it to any body.
Look at his pathetic upbringing. He admits that he totured animals.
It is an abomination that any logical person would buy in to his perverted style of christionism.
I am completely ashamed that someone like this could actually have power over good american people.
What the hell is yopur problem people?
Do you want to abuse your children as he says? Do you like persecuting you fellow humans? I hope you do because when your toime comes he will come after you too. Make no mystake that this meglomaniac perverted bastard will come after you too.
As long as he doesn’t endorse anyone it is not illegal. It is not uncommon for other groups to use churches for the same purpose….as long as no one is endorsed.
Enough water has flowed under this bridge that it is imperitive that we move on past my vitriol and yours to try to get a grip on why the heck we are doing what we are doing.
I have been waiting for the appropriate moment to ask this question and I feel it is paramount to the outcome of our discussions here, but please bear with me a moment. I am doubtful that the exact appropriate moment will ever arrive, so here goes. This opinion is only my own.
We all agree that recent humans have been shown to exist since the stone age, at least. We fashioned rocks to make tools. We identified obsidian and flint rocks as the cutting tools of choice, and they remain one of the sharpest cutting edges known to humankind until this very day, even as surgical instruments.
I think you would all agree, atheists and christians alike (in this case- this audience) that civilization was established well before the birth of the Abrahmic religions of Hebrew, Islam, and Christianity. Moral codes were well established before Abraham.
Hamurrabi had cast his codes in stone, the Enumma Elish (”When On High) had been written by the ancient Sumarians, the flood story had been told, and the god Horus, with exact paralells to Jesus, had already been formulated into a belief system.
So, just what would we use as a moral guide if we discarded the superstitious ancient belief sytems?
That is the question that seems to be paradoxical to christians and atheists alike. It is ingrained in us to have a benevolent creator resposible for all of this.
I actually feel compelled to give you some hints, yet let you dangle in your curiosity for a while as you contemplate why twenty first century people would espouse a different paradigm than our ancient ancestors.
So, you say, dale, what the hell are you talking about?
I am talking about the most important social issue of the twenty first century.
What are we going to do about ethics and morals if we discard the bible.?
Only when this issue is resolved can we transcend all these petty arguments that we have perpetuated, in my experience, here for almost a year now. And, the most important issue that has been largely ignored by all parties to this discussion.
The ancient writings reflect the value systems of their day.
We now have our current value systems but nobody wants to identify them as such because they do not have a code, or firm basis, on which to ground them.
Your assignment, if you choose to accept it, is:
What would you do to enable our society to live in total peace with one another, and what would you do to eliminate bigotry and hatred in our society?
How novel would it be to use our intellect and reason to conclude that it is counter productive to run around:
killing each other
Lying to each other
posessing each other
using ancient myths to marginalize minorities
abuse children
abuse each other
abuse the elderly
use our intelligence to subjugate others
use our intelligence to make money from the less fortunate rand gain profit from them
perpetuate ancient myths to control more ignorant segments of society rather than educate them
Need I go on?
We need to use the intellect, reason, and logic that we posess to make a better society rather than go on the ways of those superstitious, science- ignorant stone age illiterates.
We need to understand that is a much higher calling to educate all people rather than encumber them with ancient belief systems.
enough out of me for now.
I couldn’t agree with you more, Dale.
“We now have our current value systems but nobody wants to identify them as such because they do not have a code, or firm basis, on which to ground them.”
Its called humanism dale
. Its the modern codified value system we all live by, even the vast majority of religious folks. Heck, the motto of the American Humanist Association is “Values for today.” Humanism addresses all of the issues you listed above and probably a little more. Many religious folks however go bat shit crazy if you call it what it is, as it minimizes their holy book of choice. All this despite adhering to all of its major tenets.
Humanism, oddly enough, is at the roots of Christianity and at the Protest Reformation. Each of these revolutions (and many more) were spurts towards a more humanistic outlook. It is also behind the sparks that led to the Renaissance and the Age of Enlightenment and directly behind the underpinnings of what America was/is all about.
Without humanistic thought and ideas, none of these revolutions from Christianity to America would have happened.
I’m sure you knew all this and were just throwing out a bone for the rest of us >:-D
Dobson, a.k.a ‘Dogma’son is Der Fuehrer of the American Taliban Tax the defaecation out of Focus on you own damn Family. Take away ‘Dogma’son’s tax exempt status. He is THE MOST DANGEROUS man in America. ‘Dogma’son is America’s Osama bin Laden.
Very good, John. You get an A+ for your insight.
Moonie and Mark shall recieve F- or, better yet, an Incomplete.
It is apparent that humanism should be taught in the public schools and it is way overdue.
It is completely constitutional as it depends completely on history, psycology, and anthropology to show the value of being moral and ethical. It is the voice of reason.
It is my new rule (if I may, indeed, be so ostentatious) that if someone quotes the bible, they also must present a societal, psycological and/ or anthropological/ historical value system to support the biblical tenet. Then we can start making some progress.
You would find a lot more kids would respond to this type of moral/ ethical training rather trying to get them to believe all this guy-in-the-sky stuff.
Example- You cannot and should not be able to say in a public school that it is wrong to abuse children because Jesus said so. Nobody cares what Jesus said because he does not show any value in behaving the way he is saying to behave. But if you show the value system at work here, it has been shown to be highly effective at producing far more acceptable behaviour patterns than trying to scare the shit out of a kid by threatening them with eternal hell and damnation. Very simply (and this is oversimplified) one does not want to abuse kids because it is detrimental to society. It becomes a generational perversion.
For those of you in the remedial class, I shall digress to a simple definition.
Humanism is a category of active ethical philosophies that affirm the dignity and worth of all people, based on the ability to determine right and wrong by appeal to universal human qualities—particularly rationalism. Humanism is a component of a variety of more specific philosophical systems, and is also incorporated into some religious schools of thought.
Humanism entails a commitment to the search for truth and morality through human means in support of human interests. In focusing on the capacity for self-determination, humanism rejects transcendental justifications, such as a dependence on faith, the supernatural, or divinely revealed texts. Humanists endorse universal morality based on the commonality of human nature.
For the edification of those that need it, there is also a branch referred to as Religious Humanism that is kinda, sorta, acceptable to this writer.
Humanism features an optimistic attitude about the capacity of people, but it does not involve believing that human nature is purely good or that each and every person is capable of living up to the humanist ideals of rationality and morality. If anything, there is the recognition that living up to our potential is hard work and requires the help of others. The ultimate goal is human flourishing; making life better for all of us. Even among humanists who do believe in some sort of an afterlife, the focus is on doing good and living well in the here and now, and leaving the world better for those who come after us, not on suffering through life to be rewarded afterwards.
Humanism was “invented” by the most early Homo Sapiens and beyond that (another discussion.)
Pagans were pure humanists and used their array of gods as intermediaries to ask for rain, fetility, etc.
Only later did egos evolve to the point where religion was used as an element of power and control as it is still used today.
It is very interesting to study isolated civilizations practicing their indigenous “religion.”
Most of these are very kind and benevolent to children and the elderly. Some of their welfare systems could be a great model for our own.
As John McGinn so eloquently pointed out above, like it or not, modern christianity grew out of humanisim, but in a superstitious way that describes the world view of the originators of that system.
We must begin to teach our kids about rational value systems or we will end up victims of the Reconstuctionists as outlined by Clark in his post of this morning.
Dale!
How come I get an “F’? According to this blog, he’s doing nothing different than other special interest groups as long as no one is endorsed. Civil rights groups used the church to great effect during the “60’s for voter participation!
I don’t follow Dobson, Robertson or any of those other characters, I just like to be a sandspur in your sock! You do know what a sandspur is, right? I run into them a lot while sitting around the gas station having my moon pie and RC and cogitating whether we landed on the moon or not. (I think we did, the weather has not been the same since)!
Sure I do do. I just happen to remember from a botany class I took about 33 years ago that a sadspur or sandbur is any of several grasses of the genus Cenchrus, especially C. tribuloides, of the eastern United States and tropical America, having a spiny burlike envelope that surrounds several one-grained spikelets. I remember it distinctly.
I would prefer to charaterize it- As I slide down the banister of life you are a splinter in my ass.
I can’t argue with you about the cicil rights matter, but I consider that a noble cause.
I consider what Dobson wants to accomplish as an ignoble cause.
I hereby name you, appropriately “splinter.” I like it!
That’s good Dale, I already forgot what IUSFP stood for!
Personally, I liked Shitbird best…
!!!! Me too Steph!!!!!
Illogical user of stupid facts person- I cant forget. I think I was a bit more cantankerous than usual that day!
Oh…I see now, you two are gonna team up on me.
I may start using “Mr. Anonymous”. Then you won’t know who I am!
Splinter,
You can call yourself anything you want. Stephanie and me and Alex, and McGinn and John E. and Rick and the others will smoke you out and chase you like a scalded dog.
There is no possibility that you can hide, as there is no possibility that I can do so.
We know you by your rhetorical views.
You do have a brick wall that you will hit at every turn. And that is the wall of reason.
You either jump on the train, or sit on the tracks.
I do, however, support your decision to continue to try to make your case, even in this environment of rationality.
It’s kinda funny, and you do serve a purpose as an example to others who would be too shy to actually air their ive views here. You do that in a most humble and honest manner. I do appreciate your attitude. After all, the only disability in life is a bad attitude.
You do remain a sandspur in my sock. But, someone has to keep me honest. Why not you?
By the way, I was asking one of my cronies why you guys would put the salted peanuts in your RC cola and he responded immediately that it is the same reason that you all boill your peanuts; most of you do not have any teeth so you have to soften them up in order to be able to masticate and swallow them. Is there any truth to that?
If it would come down to you and me on a battlefield, in mortal combat, I am convinced that we would cover each other to the utmost extent.
With all Due Respect,
dale.
We got all our teeth Dale. Peanuts are boiled in salty water to penetrate the shell and make them yum yum good!
I think the general absense of teeth is more indigenous to YOUR area.
However, I would gladly cover you or any of your pals on the battlefield……just not this battlefield!
Let’s remember not to take these exchanges for granted. Some governments would never allow it’s constituents to voice conflicting viewpoints….conflicting with theirs, that is.
Sandspur,
Amen brother.
You can’t have it both ways…if you want to retain your tax-exempt status, then you need to keep your pulpit free of political rhetoric. I believe a pastor can, as an INDIVIDUAL, involve him/herself in election activities, BUT, the minute that involvement spills over to the pulpit, all bets are off. When you start spouting political rhetoric from the pulpit, you are violating the agreement by which your church received its tax-exemption. When you violate the agreement, the contract is terminated, and you can start negotiations with the IRS for filing your yearly claim form.
Actually, they have to be careful, but a preacher can talk about voting for candidates that oppose gay marriage or abortion, but they can’t actually endorse a candidate.
[…] You’ll remember that in August, Focus on the Family announced a massive campaign to influence the elections in eight targeted states. The campaign was touted as the largest political effort by the religious right since the heyday of the Christian Coalition and reportedly combines a massive voter registration effort, the distribution of voter guides, and a series of high profile “Stand for the Family” events across the country featuring both Dobson, Family Research Council head Tony Perkins, and Gary Bauer. […]